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| Derived from | ||||
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| The Kraken's Wrath | 1 | 0 | 2 | 1.0 |
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| GreyStag | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1.0 |
| Kraken The Whip 2core test | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1.0 |
BTrain 125
A hard-hitting, resilient Squid/Stag deck that can take just as big a beating as it can dish out. Asha and the Great Kraken will often form the backbone for your strategy, and the character load-out is specifically geared to take advantage of Greyjoy's favorite "stealth" keyword. Unopposed is the goal here, not only for the power, but for the triggers on the Great Kraken and We Do Not Sow, which is one of the best cards in this deck. Not only is it location/economy control, but that, along with Maester Cressen gives you an incredibly robust, built-in protection from getting Milked. I added in one further bit of redundancy in that department with Aeron Damphair filling a great 1x flex slot: if your Asha or your Balon gets Milked, and you think you can win dominance, sac them to a military challenge and bring them back at the end of the round. And best of all, these layers of protection open up a plot deck slot most other factions need to devote to Confiscation.
So what to do with that extra slot? The best change I've made to this deck that really unlocked its play potential is the second Noble Cause. These Greyjoys are beefy, and if you want your events to trigger on the back-end of challenges, or start getting them outfitted with Throwing Axes and Little Birds, you're going to need extra gold to boot. The obvious concern is that you're giving up first player (and for that reason, Kraken's Grasp is out), but if you're essentially giving yourself 7 gold to get out lords and ladies in the marshal phase, you should almost always be able to trade to your advantage. Failing that, you should be in a position to flood the board with chuds for claim soak. In a worst case scenario, Noble Cause is a solid defense against what could be a 2-claim attack; at best, it's ramping up your board state and engineering a big advantage you can press.
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You make a very good point about Calling The Banners and I think it's actually the perfect late-game complement to Noble Cause. I'm definitely going to try it out. Just playing devil's advocate, I could see the argument that in order to hit 7 gold, they have to have 4 characters on the board, and anything beyond that might mean it's time for a Wildfire. Noble Cause definitely is the safer bet, but Greyjoy loves aggression so calling those banners might be a great idea. As for Bastard in Hiding it's just pure efficiency. The Vanguard reaction just doesn't strike me as overly fantastic in that I can only see it making an impact in incredibly fringe cases. A 2/2 bicon just feels like a better deal to me. YMMV. Thanks for the input, can't wait to try out Banners! |
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This is a good discussion. You can make the argument that A Noble Cause is the best way to put expensive characters early on ( prior 4 chars for Banners for example) , but the real questions is - do you really want that? Yeah a strong character early on looks like a no brainer, but to my experience they get either Milked, or Marched, or Knelt, or ... beaten up with Put to the Sword... So the argument is A Noble Cause makes more sense than Calling the Banners only early game, yet spitting out your big-hitters while having 1 or 2 other chars on the board isn't the best play. Also Naval Superiority just wrecks the s**t out of it. Calling the Banners also gets wrecked by Naval, but you don't play early banners because they don't have enough chars and they play early Naval, because they expect you to play "money plot". Having said all that, Calm Over Westeros must be one of the best money plots and it's perfect for early game. First its only trait is Summer so it is immune to Naval Superiority, second you can claim MIL as the plot trigger and thus safely allow yourself to setup board for 1 round. Different factions and dfferent decks require different amount of gold. However, I've found the standard to be 2 money plots per deck. My personal choice for those 2 plots would be Calling the Banners and Calm Over Westeros :) Just some thoughts on the topic ... and why 2x A Noble Cause might be the worst way to have money plots in your deck. :) Also the whole 2/2 bicon and X/X Y-con, I don't get it. Obv it's a 1.0 value appreciation thing, but I haven't played 1.0 so I don't understand it. On the other hand sapping 1-2-3 power doesn't seem like a bad thing. :) |
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I think we have two interesting philosophies on how we build our plot decks. I prefer to build mine to set a quick and commanding board state, whereas you're tailoring your options to slow the other person down. I haven't played enough to know whether one is better than the other (I also didn't play 1e), but I'm finding I prefer cards I can reliably trigger every time without having to meet a condition I can't control. As far as Milking and Marching go, I'm not terribly worried about either. This deck packs enough attachment removal (We Do Not Sow, Cressen, Damphair) that Milk doesn't often stick around, and it's easy to play around March just by having even one chud on the board. I also think building your plot deck to avoid Naval Superiority is a pretty big overreaction. It doesn't seem like a card most people will run because it's 2 gold that has a big chance to do nothing. But let's say for the sake of example that it hits on turn one. You're now stuck reducing a lord or lady by 2 gold from a starting base of zero, and yes that does kind of suck, but you also know they're not going to be doing much because they have 2 gold straight up. Consider though that getting a Kingsroad on setup means you're right back at 5 gold for a lord or lady: that'll let you afford Asha, Aeron, Littlefinger, Melisandre and Theon - five of your seven Noble Cause triggers - and your opponent is STILL only on 2 gold. And honestly, I don't think it's worth evaluating past turn one because that's where it most likely to make the biggest and most reliable impact. Calm Over Westeros is definitely a good card, and good money to boot, but in my testing it didn't gel with the aggressive nature of Greyjoy. If you're playing the deck right, you can usually absorb any punishment that comes your way and then dish it out even harder when it's your turn. |
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"but you also know they're not going to be doing much because they have 2 gold straight up" I've been playing with Naval Superiority a lot in my Greyjoy decks and what I can explain is the following. Yes, you start with 2 gold, but it's right after setup. Usually/Hopefully you would have Asha/Theon/Some other Stealth thrown on the table and that really makes the opponent suffer while playing with his setup (assuming he doesn't play Greyjoy too). :) and yeah Naval Superiority , as I said, is turn 1 or 2 in 90% of the cases(depending if your opponent expects it or not). Also, generally speaking, I disagree with statements like " if you have kingsroad on setup", because you (Greyjoy) can also have kingsroad on setup and then you are back to 5g from the 2g Naval Superiority plot :) Don't you agree? About the attach removal, I agree with what you say, but Aeron Damphair doesn't make it easy with 1x and no The Iron Throne. Maester Cressen can dish out some work though. I just want to elaborate a bit more, on what I said that if you play big characters get Milked easy. One of the reason for that to happen is because the longer you hold Milk, you risk to it being discarded while waiting( for example). If you land Robbert, Balon, Euron ... that's like an auto-cast for any milk you are holding. However if you play some "almost worthy" milk chars early on, like Theon, the opponent risks by holding onto that milk. :) It's a very interesting mind game in my opinion |
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I think I would want Hand's Judgment, if all you're bringing in Little Bird for is to counter Tears. |
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Looks like a refined list. Lack of Naval Superiority in a Greyjoy list always makes me sad :( Also a but on the safe side with 2x A Noble Cause and I don't understand the lack of Calling the Banners since it generates minimum 7 gold ( same as A Noble Cause + effect) and it has way higher initiative.
Also any reason for 2x Bastard in Hiding not being a Vanguard Lancer ?
1x Aeron Damphair , but you aren't playing The Iron Throne , so I guess that is fine. However, I prefer going for Iron Throne and Aeron so you can recur most of your lads. ;)